On May 21, 4:33=A0pm, john....@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
> On 21 May, 22:10, Jerry Kraus <jkraus_1...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On May 21, 4:02 pm, john....@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
>
> > > > Virtually all of Stalin's close associates in positions of power
in
> > > > government were executed. =A0On the other hand, the average
Russian
> > > > lived much longer than under the Tsars, and life expectancy
advanced=
> > > > much more rapidly for Russians under Stalin than it did in
> > > > contem****ary Europe or America.
>
> > > You keep on about that. If 1 in 10 were either executed or sent to a
> > > camp would you justify that on the basis that the other 90% were
not?
>
> > > > So, those in positions of power in
> > > > the Soviet Union were at risk, while the average Russian was
> > > > relatively secure.
>
> > > You don't seem to have grasped the nature of =A0Stalinist society.
>
> > > > Just the opposite of the situation in the
> > > > contem****ary United States, under Capitalism, where the rich are
> > > > secure, and everyone else is at risk. =A0Interesting, no?
>
> > >http://www.mercatornet.com/articles/the_whisperers/
>
> > > The Whisperers: Private life in Stalin=92s Russia | by Orlando Figes
|=
> > > Allen Lane | 2007 | =A325
>
> > > The sub-title of this relentlessly unhappy story =96 "Private life
in
> > > Stalin=92s Russia" =96 is somewhat ironic; for as Orlando Figes,
Profe=
ssor
> > > of History at Birkbeck College, University of London, demonstrates
so
> > > eloquently in his book, the whole point of Stalin=92s autocratic
rule
> > > was that there was essentially no private life for the ordinary
> > > citizens of the Soviet Union. Shortly after the death of Lenin in
1924=
> > > and until his own death in 1953, Stalin was the undisputed master of
> > > the lives of his fellow Russians. Indeed, the "steel" that was his
> > > sobriquet "entered all of us", as one citizen admitted. The soul of
> > > the nation, as of its individual members, was warped and disfigured
by=
> > > the processes of practical Communism.
>
> > > Figes has built his weighty book =96 over 600 pages =96 around the
liv=
es
> > > of 14 families. Much of the evidence he has gathered comes from oral
> > > history, the reminiscences of the children and grandchildren of the
> > > revolution. This is supplemented by letters, generally sent from the
> > > Gulag and often heartbreaking, as well as diaries and memoirs
written
> > > during the de-Stalinisation that took place after Stalin=92s death.
> > > Figes=92s title suggests with a single word the state of
psychological=
> > > fear experienced by Russian citizens during those decades. There are
> > > two words for "whisperer" in Russian: one who whispers out of fear
and=
> > > one who informs or spies. During Stalin=92s regime, "the whole of
Sovi=
et
> > > society was made up of whisperers of one kind or another".
>
> > I didn't say life in the Soviet Union was pleasant. =A0It wasn't. =A0I
> > said people lived longer than ever before in Russia, and their life
> > expectancy increased more rapidly than in Europe or America.
>
> They presumably had a lot of catching up to do. That legacy did not
> even last.
>
> > =A0This was
> > Stalin's goal, and he achieved it. =A0He ruled through terror, but he
> > accomplished goals that were worth accompli****ng, through terror.
>
> Do you believe the ends justify the means? In that case genocide might
> be a good idea & cannibalism is a good way of securing a high protein
> diet.
>
> > While the population of the U.S. was stagnant -- in the 1930's -- the
> > population of Russia increased substantially.
>
> > As I say, there are tradeoffs in everything. =A0Maximize the good,
> > minimize the bad.
>
> Hitler built the autobahns.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
I didn't say everything Hitler did was bad. I said virtually
everything Hitler did after 1938 was bad.
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