"Reality_CheckŠ" <Reality@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in
news:6eqi2mF8eq8fU1@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> "Gray Ghost" <grey_ghost471-newsgroups@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
>> "Reality_CheckŠ" <Reality@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote
>>> "richard" <member@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
>>>> On Wed, 23 Jul 2008 14:31:59 -0600, "_ Prof. Jonez _"
>>>> <theprof@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
>>>>>Bama Brian wrote:
>>>>>> Reality_CheckŠ wrote:
>>>>>>> "David Hartung" <d_hartung@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
>>>>>>>> _ Prof. Jonez _ wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Gray Ghost wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> And in so doing saved the lives of many more people by forcing
>>>>>>>>>> the Japanese out of the war.
>>>>>>>>> Complte BULL**** apologia.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> So it would be ok for another nation to nuke a major U$ city, if
>>>>>>>>> they believed it would "save more lives" from their point of
>>>>>>>>> view, eh numbnuts?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Your absence of morality is repugnant. May your family be the
>>>>>>>>> first to suffer from it.
>>>>>>>> Truman, using the information he had available at the time,
>>>>>>>> determined that the use of nuclear weapons would bring the War to
>>>>>>>> an end without the necessity of invading the Japanese Home
>>>>>>>> Islands.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So it was done for expedience, easier for the U$$A.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Given the record of the war, it is likely that doing so not only
>>>>>>>> saved thousands of American lives, but also Japanese lives.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Utterly bull**** speculation.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Why is this a bad thing?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If deliberately dropping NUCLEAR BOMBS upon civilian population
>>>>>>> centers -- TWICE --
>>>>>>> killing 100,000+ innocent civilians, women and children in the
>>>>>>> process isn't a "bad thing"
>>>>>>> in your world, then you really should be in the dock ahead of
>>>>>>> Karadzic, you repugnant
>>>>>>> piece of crap.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Do you remember how the Pacific War started? The Japanese bombed
>>>>>> Pearl Harbor on December 7, 1941 in a complete sneak attack.
>>>>>
>>>>>You really are a pig-ignorant imbecile <typical yank> if you,
>>>>>being over the age of 8, think for a moment that's "how the Pacific
>>>>>War started".
>>>>>
>>>>>ROTFLMAO!
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> No. It is how the US became involved in an already existing war.
>>>
>>> Close ... but still wrong as usual, Richard.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Please clarify. I've been studying this period for 20+ years. Seems to
>> eb the consensus of historians up to this point. Have you another fact
>> based view?
>
> The U$ was already "involved" in an economic war agaist Japan prior to
> Pearl Harbor,
> by overtly sup****ting China in it's war with Japan, the U$ embargo of
> scrap metal, gasoline
> and oil against Japan during it's war with China places the U$A directly
> in the hostilities
> against Japan. The further blockade of all Japanese ****ps from the
Panama
> Canal long
> before Pearl Harbor was yet another open hostile wartime act against
> Japan, the above placing
> Japan in grave jea****dy from its enemies.
>
> You openly **** with another country that is at war, taking sides,
> sup****ting their enemies,
> engaging in direct harmful acts of economic and logistic sabbotage,
> encourage other nations
> to do the same, jea****dise and harm the safety of that nation via their
> ability to defend themselves against their wartime enemies, then YOU
have
> willingly and openly placed yourself at war with said nation(s).
>
So you approve of the Rape of Nanking and we should not have been involved
then. Interesting morality.
The Nanking Massacre, commonly known as the Rape of Nanking, was an
infamous
war crime committed by the Japanese military in Nanjing (Nanking), then
the
capital of the Republic of China, after it fell to the Imperial Japanese
Army
on December 13, 1937. The duration of the massacre is not clearly defined,
although the violence lasted well into the next six weeks, until early
February 1938.
During the occupation of Nanking, the Japanese army committed numerous
atrocities, such as rape, looting, arson and the execution of prisoners of
war and civilians. Although the executions began under the pretext of
eliminating Chinese soldiers disguised as civilians, it is claimed that a
large number of innocent men were intentionally misidentified as enemy
combatants and executed as the massacre gathered momentum. A large number
of
women and children were also killed, as rape and murder became more
widespread.
According to the International Military Tribunal for the Far East,
estimates
made at a later date indicate that the total number of civilians and
prisoners of war murdered in Nanking and its vicinity during the first six
weeks of the Japanese occupation was over 200,000. That these estimates
are
not exaggerated is borne out by the fact that burial societies and other
organizations counted more than 155,000 buried bodies. Most were bound
with
their hands tied behind their backs. These figures do not take into
account
those persons whose bodies were destroyed by burning, by throwing them
into
the Yangtze River, or otherwise disposed of by the Japanese.[1] The extent
of
the atrocities is debated between China and Japan, with numbers[2] ranging
from some Japanese claims of several hundred,[3] to the Chinese claim of a
non-combatant death toll of 300,000[4]. A number of Japanese researchers
consider 100,000 200,000 to be an approximate value.[5] Other nations
usually believe the death toll to be between 150,000300,000.[6] This
number
was first promulgated in January of 1938 by Harold Timperley, a journalist
in
China during the Japanese invasion, based on re****ts from contem****ary
eyewitnesses. Other sources, including Iris Chang's The Rape of Nanking,
also
conclude that the death toll reached 300,000. In December 2007, newly
declassified U.S. government do***ents revealed an additional toll of
around
500,000 in the area surrounding Nanking before it was occupied.[7]
In addition to the number of victims, some Japanese nationalists have even
disputed whether the atrocity ever happened.[8] While the Japanese
government
has acknowledged the incident did occur,[9] some Japanese nationalists
have
argued, partly using the Imperial Japanese Army's claims at the
International
Military Tribunal for the Far East, that the death toll was military in
nature and that no such civilian atrocities ever occurred. This claim has
been criticised by various figures, citing statements of non-Chinese at
the
Tribunal, other eyewitnesses and by photographic and archaeological
evidence
that civilian deaths did occur.
Condemnation of the massacre is a major focal point of Chinese
nationalism.
In Japan, however, public opinion over the severity of the massacre
remains
widely divided this is evidenced by the fact that whereas some Japanese
commentators refer to it as the 'Nanking massacre' (?????, Nankin
daigyakusatsu?), others use the more ambivalent term 'Nanking Incident'
(????, Nankin jiken?). However, this term can also refer to a separate
Nanjing Incident that occurred during the 1927 Nationalist seizure of the
city as a part of the Northern Expedition, in which foreigners in the city
were attacked. The 1937 massacre and the extent of its coverage in school
textbooks continues to be a point of contention and controversy in Sino-
Japanese relations.
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