Re: Does Barack Hussein Obama stand for anything? Now he will

> From: "John Rennie" <john-rennie@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> Newsgroups: 
>
alt.activism.death-penalty,talk.politics.misc,aus.politics,uk.politics.misc
> Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 10:50:31 +0100
> Subject: Re: Does Barack Hussein Obama stand for anything? Now he will
> "rethink"Iraq troop pullout position
> 
> 
> "Bill Bonde { ''Soylent Diesel is People'')"
<tributyltinpaint@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> wrote in message news:48742C2C.5B99DCD1@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> 
>> 
>> John Rennie wrote:
>>> 
>>> "Bill Bonde { ''Soylent Diesel is People'')"
>>> <tributyltinpaint@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>>> wrote in message news:4873E623.B6E03E92@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Jeffrey Turner wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> David Johnston wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Tue, 08 Jul 2008 08:54:27 -0400, Jeffrey Turner
>>>>>> <jturner@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> You appear to have lost track of your point.  That the voters are
>>>>>>>> by
>>>>>>>> now mostly opposed to the war and thus are more inclined to vote
>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>> the party does not mean the Democrats promised to cut off funding
>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>> leave the troops to die.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> There was plenty of money for an orderly withdrawal of troops if
>>>>>>> Congress refused to supply more funding.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Uh-hunh.  And why would this orderly withdrawl of troops occur?
>>>>> 
>>>>> Because the commanders would recognize that there was no money to
>>>>> maintain the occupation.
>>>>> 
>>>> You are willing to give up all these hard won gains? For what?
>>> 
>>> Hard won gains!    You mean defeating al Qa'ida who were only there in
>>> the
>>> first place because the Americans invaded Iraq.   You're a laugh a
>>> minute,
>>> Bill.
>>> 
>> So you think there's nothing to be gained by getting rid of Saddam
>> and giving Iraqis hope for their future?
> 
> 
> There was absolutely NOTHING gained by getting rid of Saddam.   If the
dust
> ever settles on Iraq which is doubtful the boss of that unhappy country
will
> be a strong man who will be very harsh - not unlike Saddam really.  
There
> is absolutely no chance of a western style democracy ever running such a
> region. 


> 
 I would qualify that a little.  I think there's some hope for Kurdistan.
They have been very quietly going their own way, having their own
elections
which have provided them with their own relatively democratic government.
This morning's Wall Street Journal Europe announces that they are awash in
crude oil.

Of course there are problems. Because the central Iraqi government does
not
recognize the Kurd government, they have problems trans****ting their
crude.
And there are all those enemies lurking around them, who do not want to
see
even inklings of an independent Kurdistan.  But still they are trying, and
they seem to have managed a certain amount of peace and prosperity in
their
area.  I wish them well.

Donna Evleth